A note on names

[kaberett]

Women who change their name on marriage do not get asked their "real name". One's mother's maiden name is presumed to be secret enough that it's reasonable to use it as a security check - but it's also utterly innocuous, and typically public knowledge of a woman's maiden name will not cause her any harm.

Compare and contrast: the experiences of trans people.

Comments

[pipisafoat]

(personally i don't use my mother's maiden name ever because it's her middle name and she has it on several public things but i'm never a common use case.)

anyway YES. today my mother met me at work and came in and used my birth name, and everyone was like "who?" and she was like "yes, [pronoun] is lying to you about [pronoun] name." UM SORRY BUT THAT'S NOT HOW IT WORKS. and it isn't even a trans-pretending-not-happening thing for her (oh god my wording, what even is that) because she doesn't know because she's so bad about everything.

on the plus side!!!! my highly irritating (to me) voice, someone said it is a good thing i have such a low, androgynous voice (for working with people with hearing impairments) and that made me really happy. (i hear it horridly high in my head, so it's yay.) and someone called me by neutral pronouns in the grocery store today! (and my mother didn't correct them!) i am surviving this summer okay on the gender front.

also my boss-person was super-cool when I was like "actually on this super-official national-level evaluation form you should write my legal name" and she was just like "okay, spell it for me!" and then like. immediately put it out of her head? like it just doesn't matter. (which it doesn't! which is why that mattered. confusing to many but not to you i wager.)

[kaberett]

Yeah that is why I specified "women who change their name on marriage", because I think men who do it DO get that shit and also? My mum didn't change her name, and when I changed my forename I also ditched my dad's surname because. Reasons.

HURRAH YOUR BOSSPERSON, boo your mother. Also not confusing & wording fine; look at you wordsing like a wordy thing!

also ♥ and I am just on my bed and wow, one of these days I should actually leave you a comment half as thoughtful as the ones you leave me!

[pipisafoat]

yes. yes. a thing [many] people understand. you are smart.

am now arguing with a stubborn watch booklet to learn how to operate my new watch. (i need to be a watch-wearer again. i have not been a watch-wearer since i stopped running. but now i need it for reasons of sneaky pulse-taking and less-awkward rest-break-timing.) i just need to set it, but that's hard? i can work the timer! and the stopwatch! (heck to the yes, my new watch has BOTH, i love it.) but setting time is hard because the booklet is like "how about i curl up awkwardly instead of opening at all" and urgh. frustrating watch packaging that makes booklets curl up. (when complete that task: will be hunting flights for my vacation, hooray vacation! hooray an awesome sibling&spouse who are paying for my flight to make my vacation possible!!!)

[shehasathree]

YES.

[damerell]

One's mother's maiden name is presumed that even though it flagrantly is a matter of public record, apropos of nothing much.

Completely beside the point....

[dreamatdrew]

... But this is why I autosubstitute 'middle' for 'maiden' when asked that question. Because she HATES that name, and therefore does not tell it to people, and also, bank-switching is the easiest form of obfuscation.

[pretty_panther]

THIS. It is such a load of bullshit. And then people that say it is too hard for them to remember the name trans people will to go by but they can easily remember a married woman's name. Bullshit.

[stephdairy]

I get surnames wrong for married people more than I do for trans people, I think. It's not good to get it wrong in either case, but it feels more likely to be more damaging in the latter case so I think some bit of me tries harder. Also, you don't use your friends' surnames so often so there's less practice.

[naath]

I forget what married couples have done with their names, unless I didn't know their names prior to marriage. I don't often use friend's surnames though.

On the other hand I guess some people expect married women to change their names but don't expect people to *ever* change the name-they-go-by. I don't expect that, but I know several people who have changed their name so I guess I'm used to it? Also I go by two names so maybe that effects my ability to accept other people changing?

Also I'm awful at remembering people's names if I don't use them often. So people I interact with most days are very easy. But people I only see occasionally it's harder. But their name-changes don't affect that; it's just a blanket "I know I should know your name but I don't. Sorry" sort of memory fail.

[untonuggan]

Yes. This.

[sorrillia]

So, my mom didn't change her name, either, and she regularly gets people telling her that her last name isn't "real" when they find out she's married, and substituting in my father's last name as her "real name". Also, a number of her relatives insist on addressing holiday cards to her as "Mrs. [husband's last name]", although she uses "Ms." and has never used "Mrs." or that name.

I am still very confused by why anyone thinks that maiden names---which are generally a matter of public record---are a reasonable security check. But then, my school's medical office thinks that name and date-of-birth is unbreakable security. Even though, for students, year of birth often easy to back out of academic year and day and month of birth aren't just not secret, people often publicly celebrate them!

[naath]

My Mum does that to one of my Aunts, who didn't change her name. Which I found very WTF. Also since she (Mum) prefers "Mrs his-initial our-surname" she tends to do that to other people too... which UGH NO JUST NO. (reasons not to get married...)

[catyak]

When we got married, no names were changed. Much simpler that way, even though both the vet and local garage know me as Mr V2 rather than by my own surname. I hesitate to confuse them further, especially as they don't usually deal with me.

D

[catyak]

I have seen some forms that just ask for all other names by which you may now be, or previously have been, known.

D

[cadenzamuse]

/me does not have productive, non-hijacking comment because I jump to thinking all about the microaggressions of society presuming women change their names when they get married and I know it does not have bad implications for other people but fuck you I am not being transferred from family to family like property will you get my fucking name right, please

Actually, hello, I can sympathize with your experience here because mine looks similar to part of yours from a distance if you squint. But still the only harm it causes me is feeling mis-named and wanting to rage-quit. Which is real harm, but I think I am not playing oppression olympics to say that using the wrong name (i.e. the mis-naming name, probably the assigned-at-birth one) for a trans* person can and often does cause them much more harm.

[kaberett]

I think that using incorrect names for people is wrong and vile whatever the circumstances. I get regularly furious with my much-beloved grandfather because he _still_ addresses cheques/letters for my mother to Mrs [first name] [husband's surname] rather than Dr [first name] [her surname], and she has been married NEARLY TWENTY-FIVE YEARS.

Also? Conversation is welcome here. I don't expect everyone to be ~precisely on-topic~ ~at all times~...

[cadenzamuse]

Heh, Alex, I have been a little off my meds this week, so I'm only semi-socially-functional. So now I'm going to apologize for apologizing. And then apologize for that. And then say "fuck it" and wander off and read fanfiction. :-P